Tuesday, March 30, 2004 -- 9:45 AM

The witness, who is the victim's mother, was interviewed a second time by the Yoknapatawpha County Sheriff's Department. This interview was conducted by Detectives Armstrong and Murphy and was recorded on a portable tape recorder with the witness' knowledge and consent.

SM: Good morning, Mrs. Dubois. Thank you for coming in this morning.

SD: Oh you are welcome. Do you know who killed my daughter?

SM: Before we get started, would you state your name and address for the record, please?

SD: Susan Dubois. 3034 Davis Drive. Now, do you know who killed my daughter or not?

TA: We are getting very close, Mrs. Dubois, and that's why we asked you here this morning. We have a few things to clear up and straighten out. First, we could use your help in learning her relationships with several people. You probably knew her better than anybody else.

SD: Of course, Detective. I'll be glad to help in whatever way I can.

SM: First tell us about Barbara's friends -- Scarlett and Ingrid. How close were they to your daughter?

SD: Scarlett was probably her best friend. They'd known each other since they were just kids. They spent a lot of time with each other.

SM: Was Scarlett close enough for them to share their most intimate secrets?

SD: I suppose so. But I really don't know. I guess you'd have to ask Scarlett that.

TA: Did Scarlett have any reason to kill Barbara, Mrs. Dubois?

SD: Scarlett? I can't imagine Scarlett hurting anyone, least of all Barbara! She is a sweet girl, and they were truly close friends.

SM: But Barbara knew her secret, didn't she?

SD: What secret?

SM: That Scarlett has a serious eating disorder. Maybe Scarlett was afraid Barbara would reveal it and she killed her.

SD: Don't be ridiculous! Barbara knew of Scarlett's problem, and she urged her to get help. She was worried about her. But that's certainly no reason for murder!

TA: Well, what about Mrs. Webb then?

SD: I wouldn't know about Erma. She is capable of most anything if she thought it would harm Scarlett's chances in a pageant. It's hard to imagine she is capable of murder though.

SM: What about Ingrid Freeman, Mrs. Dubois?

SD: Do you mean do I think Ingrid could harm Barbara? Yes, I think Ingrid is capable of doing whatever she had to in order to eliminate tough competition.

TA: But we were led to believe Ingrid and Barbara were good friends.

SD: Barbara and Ingrid? I can't imagine where you got that. Barbara tolerated her because she had to and because she would never snub anyone, but friends? Not on your life!

SM: Tell us about Denny Buchanan. Weren't he and Barbara serious for a while there?

SD: Denny? He may have wanted it to be serious, but Barbara broke it off. They didn't really even go together very long. She thought he was shallow, conceited and that he didn't really care for her, just for his image when he was with her. She said he was a jerk.

TA: Do you think he might have killed her because she dumped him?

SD: I don't think he really cared that much, to tell you the truth.

SM: All right, Mrs. Dubois. Can you tell us the secret Barbara was going to reveal in her Truth of the Heart speech?

SD: Huh?

TA: You know -- the Truth of the Heart speech. We found it in her room. It looked as though she was going to reveal something personal. Do you have any idea what that could have been?

SD: I really don't know what you are talking about.

TA: Here, Mrs. Dubois. Read for yourself. This is a typewritten copy of the handwritten document we found in Barbara's room.

SD: Oh that was her favorite poem! She found it in high school when she was writing a paper. After that, she used to say it a lot. "We wear the mask that grins and lies, it hides our cheeks and shades our eyes." She recited it so much even I know part of it by heart.

SM: She also says she is going to quit pageant life, follow her heart and reveal a truth no matter how much it would hurt someone. Was that someone you, Mrs. Dubois?

SD: I can't imagine what-- no, there was no secret that I know of.

TA: Tell us about Barbara's pregnancy, Mrs. Dubois

SD: Pregnancy? What pregnancy? What are you talking about?

TA: The autopsy showed that she had given birth. Now we need to know about that.

SD: That was a long time ago. What possible help could that be in finding Barbara's killer. You are just trying to stir up gossip about her. She's dead! Can't you let her rest in peace?

SM: Mrs. Dubois, you want us to find who did this terrible thing to your daughter, don't
you?

SD: Of course I do, but I....

TA: Then we need to know everything about Barbara, Mrs. Dubois. Her relationship with the father of the child and any one else with an interest in the pregnancy who may have a bearing on this case. We can't eliminate any one yet. So help us here, ma'am. Tell us about her pregnancy.

SM: We know when she was a teenager you left Oxford for nearly a year. Where did she go and why?

SD: We went to Atlanta so Barbara could go to a special school to--

TA: Mrs. Dubois! That is a bunch of bull! We have several people who told us they suspect you left town to cover up Barbara's pregnancy. Now if you really want your daughter's killer brought to justice, you will tell us about the pregnancy!

SD: Oh... dear... I... Don't you understand this could hurt a lot of people?

SM: As badly as someone hurt your daughter?

TA: I'm beginning to think you had something to do with your daughter's death. Did you kill your daughter, Mrs. Dubois?

SD: What a terrible thing to say to me! How could you possibly think I could do something so awful?

SM: Then help us out here, Mrs. Dubois. Tell us about Barbara's pregnancy and the father of her child.

SD: But you don't realize-- this will hurt a lot of people.

TA: We need you to tell us all you know. This may be very helpful in apprehending your daughter's killer. If you really want that person found, we need every bit of information you have!

SD: Oh... please. Just give me a minute. Could I have a glass of water, please? This is very difficult.

SM: Here is your water. Now, about the pregnancy.

SD: Yes, Barbara was pregnant when she was 15. She was just a baby herself.

TA: And the father?

SD: This won't get out will it? He never knew. He went to Europe to school when we left Oxford. I think if he finds out now it will just tear him apart.

SM: What you tell us is confidential -- unless it turns out to have a bearing on the case when it goes to trial. Then we can't promise anything.

SD: Bill. Bill Lamar. They were just kids and thought they were in love. But she was only 15. I t could have ruined her life. Ruined her future. We went to Atlanta so no one would know.

TA: It must have been expensive to just pick up and move, like that. How did you manage?

SD: Well, we did. Okay?

SM: Mrs. Dubois, we know you were working two jobs and finances were tight. Did you have help during that year? Financial help?

SD: Well, we had someone who helped us out once in a while.

TA: We need to know who, specifically.

SD: I don't see how that matters.

TA: Hasn't keeping secrets cost you enough already, Mrs. Dubois?

SM: Just get it off your chest, Mrs. Dubois. You'll feel better.

SD: I suppose. I suppose I should.

SM: Barbara would want you to tell us the truth.

SD: Yes, she would... Allie Lamar. She helped us.

SM: What would make her want to do that?

SD: Allie Lamar contributed to Barbara's care and our support on condition we never told Bill about the baby. I convinced Barbara that Bill didn't love her and didn't want to see her any more. She never knew about the money. Allie told Bill that Barbara didn't want to see him anymore -- she was going to concentrate on her pageant life.

TA: Did Bill know Barbara was pregnant?

SD: No.

SM: Barbara never talked to him about being pregnant?

SD: She was scared. She was so young.

SM: And Allie Lamar backed you up on this?

SD: Oh, she instigated the whole thing. She told Bill that Barbara was going to Atlanta to get away from him, that she cared nothing for him and didn't want to see him anymore. She convinced him Barbara was only interested in her pageant career.

SM: So you went to Atlanta during the pregnancy. What about after the birth? What happened to the baby?

SD: We... we lost her. Barely a day old. We named her Gwendolyn. There was something wrong with her heart, the doctors said.

SM: Did Bill ever learn about the baby?

SD: No. Allie very carefully managed that.

SM: The child that died.

SD: Yes.

TA: But you continued to take payments from Allie Lamar.

SD: Yes.

SM: Didn't Mrs. Lamar know? Or were they payoffs to keep Barbara away from Bill?

SD: She had so much money, we didn't have any. And if Bill and Barbara had ever found out what Allie and I did-- I didn't tell her.

SM: You had to do more than not tell her, Mrs. Dubois.

TA: Murph, we're wasting our time here. She doesn't want her daughter's killer found. I wonder if the DA is ready to file extortion charges against her.

SD: It wasn't extortion. It was Allie Lamar's idea. She gave me the money to give to someone else.

TA: Who?

SD: Mary. Mary Jones. I sent it to the Jones for Billie Jo. We've known them for ages. I knew they wanted a child and wanted to adopt. I got Allie to pay the adoption fees--

TA: By telling her it was Barbara's child.

SD: Yes. And Barbara so loved that child -- like it was her own Gwendolyn, the child she lost.

SM: Allie never suspected?

SD: She paid to keep things quiet, Detective. She didn't nose around. We were out of sight and out of her mind.

TA: Sounds like extortion to me, Murph. How much of that money did you keep, Mrs. Dubois?

SD: None of it! I sent it to Mary, for Billie Jo. The Lamar sponsorship money went for Barbara's competitions. You can check--

TA: We will.

SM: We'll deal with that side of the story later. Someone sent Bill a note to come back for the pageant. Was that you?

SD: Oh no!

TA: Do you know who it could have been?

SD: No.

TA: What did you think when you saw Bill Lamar at the pageant?

SD: I was shocked when I saw him here. If he and Barbara ever talked-- well, I don't think Barbara would ever have spoken to me again.

SM: Did you speak to Mrs. Lamar about Bill's return?

SD: Yes, Allie about had a fit. She was almost completely panicked.

SM: So how many people knew about Billie Jo supposedly being Barbara's child? You, Mary, Barbara, Mary's husband, Allie Lamar -- anybody else? And who knew -- I mean, thought -- that Bill was the father?

SD: No, no. Mary and her husband knew Barbara's child died, but they also knew that telling anyone that Barbara was ever pregnant would ruin her pageant career, so they kept quiet. Bill didn't know anything, of course.

SD: So Mary Jones knew the money was coming from Allie Lamar?

SD: No, she didn't. Her husband didn't either.

TA: They didn't ask where you got it?

SD: I told them Barbara wanted them to have it, that she took it from her sponsorship money. And I told them that it was a secret, that they weren't supposed to know where it was from, and to never, never mention it to Barbara. They saw how happy Billie Jo made Barbara, so it worked out.

TA: But Barbara must have known?

SD: I told her the lawyer made a deal with the Lamars. She was so angry, at first she didn't want the money. Then I told her we could give it to the Joneses. They had nothing, Detective. She was happy to give it to them.

SM: Did Scarlett Webb know about the pregnancy?

SD: Not that I know of.

SM: Could anyone else have found out?

SD: I don't think so. Billie Jo's adoption records are sealed. I had Barbara keep quiet. It would have ruined her career.

SM: This is one for the books.

TA: Thank you for leveling with us, Mrs. Dubois. We are anxious to solve this as you are and I think this information you've given us today will help us do that.

SD: I don't see how all this helps.

SM: Someone who had something to lose wanted your daughter out of the way, Mrs. Dubois.

TA: If Bill Lamar and Barbara ever talked, the scheme you concocted with Allie Lamar would fall apart. Mary Jones would be out all that money then, wouldn't she?

SD: You can't think Mary had anything to do with Barbara's death? She loved her like sister and would never want any harm to come to her!

TA: Mary isn't the only one with a motive.

SM: Our investigation is ongoing, Mrs. Dubois. We'll let you know when we have a suspect in custody.

SD: Thank you, Detectives.

Interview ends -- 10:42 AM